New Zealand

Joel Skousen's Discussion Forums: Strategic Relocation: South Pacific: New Zealand
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Joel Skousen

Wednesday, February 23, 2000 - 08:45 pm Click here to edit this post
I get a lot of calls about New Zealand. Many people are drawn to the idyllic images of this small island nation ever since the radical socialist regime was ousted in the early 90's. I have not been enthusiastic about either NZ or Australia because it has been my experience that once an electorate gets used to a heavy dose of socialism, they always want more, not less--as long as the pains and costs are transferred to the "rich". So it is in Chile, England and now in NZ. The only reason voters in NZ rejected the socialist government was the financial pain. Socialist programs nearly backrupted the country. However, they have never given up the socialist ideology--only put a cap on its expenditures. As the economy in NZ weakens, the old urge to expand the government safety net is making a comeback--a sure way to keep the economy down in the future.
But worst of all, recent reports indicate some dramatic turns for the worse in NZ during the past two years. Crime is at an all time high, and so is racial tension. Fatal crimes per 100,000 people are running at 1121 per 100k in NZ, way more than second place Canada with 979, Australia with 861 and the US (supposedly the crime capital of the world) clear down at 610--less than half of NZ.
NZ also has the highest murder rate at 2.37 homicides per 100k people, which even tops violent South Africa where people are fleeing racial and criminal violence in record numbers. Many are coming to NZ and finding they have gone from the frying pan into the fire. Granted, the crime in NZ is more concentrated in certain areas, whereas it is very widespread in S. Africa.
Keep in mind too, that immigration to NZ is very restricted, and you must have a fair amount of money to join their exclusive island club. Despite playing hard to get, in the past two years NZ has actually lost more people than it gains. Like Israel, there is an idyllic image that betrays reality, with people clamoring to go back home after living there a year or two. Last year NZ lost 404,000 people to Australia alone. That is out of a possible 3.8 million people--nearly 10% have left. The natives know something rosy-eyed tourists don't see.
This isn't to say that you can't find some very nice rural places in NZ, but rather that the long term prospects for peace, especially for foreigners, is not good.

Joel Skousen

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True North

Monday, April 03, 2000 - 12:05 am Click here to edit this post
I enjoyed two months cycling NZ in 1991, and have returned there on business twice in the past few years. Although I don't have access to the kind of crime statistics Joel presents in his Feb 23, 2000 posting, the casual converstations I had corroberate his viewpoint. I talked to a Maori taxi driver who complained bitterly that Aukland's public school system was railroading his (non-white) children into manual labor oriented positions. He was resentful, and I suspect he's not alone. He also expressed concern about the increase in crime since the early 1990s. He attributed this to gangs of pacific islanders in Aukland.

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Darrell Ostler

Monday, April 03, 2000 - 05:32 am Click here to edit this post
I have a question for Joel.

I have often been asked by people in the UK if the high availability of guns in the U.S. was the reason that America was the most violent nation on the earth. I always responded based on the assumption that the U.S. was indeed the most violent. According to these stats, however, such is not the case. Where do these new stats come from? I would like to be better prepared for a future discussion on crime and violence.

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Webmaster

Wednesday, April 05, 2000 - 09:19 pm Click here to edit this post
Darrell,

I can provide some information for you based on personal research. The US is not the most violent society in the world, which the media does not want you to hear about. Crime rates here have been plummeting.

David Koppel writes about this in his book The Samurai, the Mountie, and the Cowboy: Should America Adopt the Gun Controls of Other Democracies? He is able to show that crime rates do not correlate with gun control but with other societal factors. Very interesting.

Also our very own Bureau of Justice Statistics has a report comparing the US and Great Britain. England is NOT the crime free oassis everyone assumes it is. Robbery, assault, burglary and motor vehicle theft rates are lower in the United States than they are in England and Wales but murder and rape rates are higher in the United States. The murder and rape rate margin however has been decreasing since 1980. Interesting when you condsider that shall-issue conceal carry permits for gun owners have become more available across the US during this time frame. Criminals in the US are far more likely to be caught, convicted and incarcerated longer in the US.

Australia has also scene dramatic increases in crime since firearms were confiscated several years ago. Their own Olympic shooting team has to practice outside the country due to the new restrictions. Unfortunately only the law abiding turned in their firearms there and the criminals know it. Easy pickings.

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Joel Skousen (Joel)

Thursday, November 02, 2000 - 11:38 am Click here to edit this post
Here's an article by Jim Peron on New Zealand which presents the positive view that NZ could perhaps be a Libertarian "Galt's Gulch". I don't think so, but his views are important. Joel S.

New Zealand (NZ) is a relatively small country in terms of population. It has just over 4 million residents. There are lots more sheep, but since they don’t vote I wouldn’t worry about them. If I could have some influence in South Africa, with 42 million people, then I should be able to have even more influence in NZ. So it fits the size criteria. NZ, unlike Colorado Springs or Alpine country, is a sovereign nation and this is a fact respected by the rest of the world. Even the Aussies are unlikely to send in troops to put down an ideological revolution.

Lindsay Perigo, a prominent libertarian in NZ, has shown that an active libertarian can make a difference. He has his own radio show and his magazine, Free Radical, goes out to 1,500 people. That may not seem like a lot but adjusted for population size that makes its circulation larger than Reason or Liberty in the United States.

Libertarians could survive there on the practical level as well. The economy is well developed and first world in nature. Unemployment is low and opportunities abound. It has all the first world amenities that most of us want. We would have the choice of restaurants, theater, etc that we want. It has higher educational opportunities and decent medical care. Auckland is a major city with well over one million residents. This means that urban libertarians could feel right at home there but those of us who prefer seclusion have the entire rest of the country from which to pick. Because NZ is about the size of England, with a fraction of the population, there are lots of private, rural areas to live in as well.

NZ is also a western country with basic Enlightenment values. The chances of a squatter camp in the park next to your house are minuscule. Those of us with western values will fit right in. That just leaves one more requirement: how easy is it to get in to NZ?

That is what has surprised me most. NZ is relatively welcoming to immigrants Unlike the US, with the INS Gestapo, New Zealand is encouraging immigrants. They even have a web site to facilitate matters: www.immigration.govt.nz. NZ works on the point system and at this time one needs 24 points to immigrate. Someone in their mid 20s to mid 30s would get 10 points for age. Someone with work experience could also get another 10 points. And if you have a degree that is enough to get you in without a problem. Those three together are enough to get in. Any two of the above plus a job offer is also sufficient. Most libertarians would find that they qualify on points alone.

If you don’t, there are other ways to immigrate. If you have sufficient funds you can come in as an entrepreneur. If you own a business and want to relocate it, you can go this route: be warned you will need to produce tax records to show the viability of your business; so if you’re a raving anarchist who has no tax records this could be a problem. But, with many options, the bulk of libertarians will find a way.

How does current political policy fit in for libertarians there? The 1996 Index of Economic Freedom by the Heritage Foundation says that NZ has a “well-founded free market system”. Specifically they say the following about various policies:

1. Low level of protectionism. “New Zealand has an average tariff rate of 3.2 percent. In 1994, New Zealand announced plans to eliminate all tariffs by 2004.”

2. The rates of income tax the index list are called “moderate” but these have dropped since the book was written. The top income tax rate was 33 percent and the average person paid 24 percent. Immigration consultants say that the average rate has dropped to 19.5 percent and the top rate is down to 28 percent. There is no capital gains tax except for property development. The general sales tax is 12.5 percent which is higher than many areas in the States but not that far off from the major areas like New York City or Los Angeles. For many libertarians in other countries even 12.5 percent is an improvement.

3. The government consumes 13.4 percent of GDP versus 18 percent in the United States.

4. Very low level of inflation.

5 Low barriers to foreign investment. “New Zealand actively encourages direct foreign investment and approval is routine.”

6. Very low restrictions on banking. The Index says banking is “deregulated” and there is no “deposit insurance”.

7. “Wages and prices in New Zealand are determined largely by the market. New Zealand enforces a relatively low minimum wage for most adult workers.”

8. “Private property is a fundamental right in New Zealand... Government expropriation is very unlikely.”

9. “Establishing a business in New Zealand is easy. Regulations are applied evenly and consistently.”

The competing Economic Freedom of the World 1975 -1995 published by a dozen or so free market think tanks says New Zealand had the largest increase in economic freedom in the world during this period. They said: “New Zealand now ranks as the third most free economy, behind only Hong Kong and Singapore. They also note that the top marginal tax rate was cut from 66 percent to 33 percent that the exchange controls were abolished and foreign currency accounts legalized.

Compared to the United States (according to the Index) New Zealand does quite well. It generally has lower levels of taxation and the banking sector is less regulated. The Index rates New Zealand as being more economically free than the United States. Also, unlike the US, it is relatively easy for immigration purposes which is something the Index does not take into account. It also scores better than Australia, Canada, most of Asia, South America, Africa and Europe. In the 1996 Index (which is the one I own) New Zealand was only beaten by Hong Kong (which is now under control of mainland China) and Singapore. One flaw of the Index is that it only rates economic freedom. Singapore has a relatively authoritarian political structure which does not have much respect for civil liberties. If we take civil and economic freedom both into account New Zealand is already one of the best locations to live in the world.

And that can improve with an influx of those seeking a Libertopia. There are some drawbacks. The health care system is still pretty much a welfare state. But compared to places like England, Canada or South Africa it is a relatively decent one Private options are, of course, available as well. But the drawbacks are minor compared to some of the problems that Americans have with an over-eager federal government. And for us poor South Africans, paradise may well be an island off the coast of Australia. My neighbours who are not yet inclined to leave point out that New Zealand has lots of sheep. True, very true. But as I point out: Sheep don’t shoot.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Jim Peron is the author of Die, the Beloved Country?, a book exposing the misrule by mismanagement of the African National Congress during its first term of office in South Africa. He is currently working on an expose of the Mugabe regime. He can be contacted at peron@gonet.co.za.

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genuine kiwi

Friday, September 14, 2001 - 02:46 am Click here to edit this post
Joel,
Your comment about Kiwis or New Zealanders (I am one) moving to Australia needs to be understood in a little different light. Kiwis are sometimes called "the globetrotters of the world' because a great many travel the world. It is a 'right of passage' especially for young adults. These working holidays often last 3 to 5 years or more. Australia is often the first stop. It is certainly the easiest country to get to. Australia also allows kiwis to live and work without immigration hassles. Over the years, a lot of intermarriage has occurred thus kiwis have many blood rellies to visit and stay with. So the numbers you quote are not permanent moves...just adventure-seeking kiwis. Some stay in Australia for years but most return home eventually. New Zealand has a term for this: the brain drain. We are called 'ex pats'. Probably, the biggest reason for all of this travel is New Zealand's isolated location in the world and the average kiwi's thirst for adventure and not a desire to leave home.

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Joel Skousen (Joel)

Friday, September 21, 2001 - 03:51 pm Click here to edit this post
The below comments on New Zealand were recently emailed to me.

Quote:

I've read your comments and reservations about N.Z., and they are well taken. The famous "libertarian" revolution was just a reinvention of socialism via capitalistic means. No place is perfect, and in many ways you have to "choose your poison" as it were.

I like the place because it is peaceful and has relatively little social unrest. Cops around here don't usually carry anything more lethal than pepper spray. People around here are incredibly friendly, and total strangers will talk to you like they've known you all your life (which can be pretty startling, at first). Also, New Zealanders (in my experience) are FAR more honest in their day-to-day dealings than Americans are, and I don't have to watch my back around here as much as I did back in the U.S. In short, as I considered my crisis survival plans, the crucial question for me became "who do I want as my neighbors, when TSHTF?" I like the neighbors I now have, and, for better or for worse, this is where I'm digging in.


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Greg H.

Monday, October 29, 2001 - 01:28 am Click here to edit this post
New Zealand does NOT have the highest murder rate, not anywhere even close.

For instance, in 1993 New Zealand's total homicide rate was 1.47 per 100k. Even if we use the 2.37 per 100k figure that Joel cites above, this is still comparable to the low rates of many Western European countries, and far lower than the 5.7 per 100k rate of the United States in 1999. In 1995 South Africa's total homicide rate was 75.30 per 100k, which is 50 times that of New Zealand.

Source: http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvinco.html

I do agree with Joel that a nuclear/biological war between the United States and Russia/China within the next 5-10 years is highly probable. However, I also believe that New Zealand (especially the South Island) will be a good place to avoid the direct effects of that conflict, and that it offers greater prospects for long term peace than North America.

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Ted Brownlie (Tedt)

Monday, October 29, 2001 - 02:23 am Click here to edit this post
I am interested in maybe moving to New Zealand for safety rather than stay here.. I talkedto Joel about it and he feels that Australia and New zealand are totally sold out to the NWO and these countries can be easily invaded and occupied.. He thinks that in the USA you have a very large land mass which will not be patrolled by UN forces so there will be plenty of places to hide and be safe.. Also, there are community groups like the Mormons who have experience and history of storing food and preparing to ride out the storm.. I will talk to Joel again to get more feedback because i want as much information as possible before i make my decision on where to go... Ted

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Ted Brownlie (Tedt)

Monday, October 29, 2001 - 02:45 am Click here to edit this post
Do any Joel Skousen subscribers know anything about the gun laws in New zealand? Can you own fully automatic assault rifles? This is a very important subject because inorder to be safe in my opinion you must own a firearm to protect your life.. I know there will be incredible chaos and evil here in the USA when global government arrives after WWIII and millions of us citizens are rounde up and sent to the death camps that are located all throughout te country... I pray and hope that we still have a few more years before these events start... Ted

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Greg H.

Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 01:13 am Click here to edit this post
Yes the governments of New Zealand and Australia have sold out to the "New World Order" and in a global conflict both of those countries will be occupied by Asian military forces. But nevertheless many of the remote areas there will offer a high degree of survivability if you're willing to prepare intelligently.

Approximately 20% of New Zealand households legally own firearms, mostly sporting rifles and shotguns but some semi-auto military rifles too. If you go, I'd recommend obtaining your firearms there by "nonconventional" means so they won't later be traceable to you, in the event that New Zealand experiences the widespread gun confiscation that Australia has had in recent years. More information on New Zealand gun ownership can be found at:

http://www.shootingnz.com/laws/gun_laws.ht

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Ted Brownlie (Tedt)

Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 06:59 pm Click here to edit this post
I clicked on the link above but didn't work.. i have webtv so the problem could be on my end.. i will try again later... Ted

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Greg H.

Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 11:24 pm Click here to edit this post
When I posted the 'm' got chopped off the end of the URL. I'll try again:

http://www.shootingnz.com/laws/gun_laws.htm

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Ted Brownlie (Tedt)

Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 08:17 am Click here to edit this post
Greg H: Are the remote areas in the south island? What town would you recommend? Ted

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True Blue American

Saturday, December 01, 2001 - 01:38 am Click here to edit this post
Ted:

Check out the NZ immigration website; as Joel has repeatedly stated, the criteria is primarily set up for the "exclusive island club". Most Americans think we can go to any country and reside; it just isn't so. Check out the criteria for immigration and/or residency. Age is one deterrent.

http://www.immigration.govt.nz/

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Sarah Grupfler

Monday, December 10, 2001 - 09:02 am Click here to edit this post
>>I know there will be incredible chaos and evil here in the USA when global government arrives after WWIII and millions of us citizens are rounde up and sent to the death camps that are located all throughout te country...

are you serious? wow, it must be hard to keep going in this world when you're so paranoid

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Ted Brownlie (Tedt)

Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 03:00 am Click here to edit this post
Sarah... Yes i am deadly serious and it's all true.. The laws concerning this are already on the books.. The only way you can know is to do research on your own.. For example if you search the internet by typing in words like, 'fema' 'executive orders' and 'internment camps'; the information as well as documentation will appear right before your eyes... Prove me wrong... Ted

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Lisa Ford

Friday, January 09, 2004 - 02:05 am Click here to edit this post
As a "kiwi" or New Zealander I must stand up for my country. It is the home of "Middle Earth" and as the big screen is my witness it is a beautiful country. There are good and bad people across the globe and our wee country has crime like everywhere else. The difference here is that a homicide is actually BIG NEWS. It is not an every day occurance and appears on prime time T.V.
Can the same be said for your country ?

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David Haynes (Haynesdavid)

Tuesday, December 21, 2004 - 12:57 pm Click here to edit this post
If you are rich any country will welcome you with open "arms". :')


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